Karmapolis Interview with John Lash

Recently, our brilliant colleagues, Malou and Gerry Zeitlin of openseti.org, put us in touch with Karmapolis.be, a site that explores anomalies, theories of conspiracy, and beliefs concerning alternative realities. Alain Gossens, who operates the site with his partner Bruno Michelet, lives in Brussels, and so we were able to meet and talk about mutual interests. The result was a three-part collaboration with articles by Alain on alien predation, and by myself, on Gnostic parallels to Castenada, published simultaneously in English and French.

Karmapolis: We have been discussing the idea that a parasite exists and rules our mind. How can we demonstrate to our readership that this parasite exists and that the idea of “mental infection” is not delusional ?

JLL: Like an infection, the mental parasite would be detected by its symptoms. Malaria, for instance, produces violent symptoms caused by a foreign entity that invades the body. To think clearly about the parasites, we must consider that certain behavior, and certain forms of thinking, in particular religious ideologies, would be symptomatic of an infection or foreign invasion of the human mind.

Karmapolis: What is the nature and the origin of this parasite ? Is it a interdimensional intelligence? Is it possible that it takes an organic form?

JLL: According to the Gnostics, the parasites or Archons, as they called them, originate with the earliest phase of the formation of the solar system, before the Earth coalesced as a planetary organism. Their habitat is the solar system, exclusive of the Earth, moon and sun. They are inorganic forms with intelligence of an electrical nature – cyborgs, as we would say.

Karmapolis: The Gnostic Texts (Nag Hammadi Codices, NHC) describe the Eons and the Archons. To explain it simply to our readership, what are the differences between the Eons and the Archons ?

JLL: In Gnostic cosmology, Aeons or Eons are gods, deities, divinities. They are not creator-gods or point entities, however. They are rather like massive alive, aware, currents. They are the forces that form the central core of the galaxy we inhabit, the Pleroma. Archons are an anomalous species of inorganic beings that arise outside the Pleroma, in the limbs or arms of the galaxy. They are called Archons (from Greek archai, “elementary, from the beginning”) because they arise first, before the Earth is formed. Their bodies are formed of elementary matter (quantum fields) in a pre-organic state.

Karmapolis: Do you think that the flyers described by Castaneda and the Archons of the Gnostics are really the same thing?

JLL: Yes, I am convinced they are the same.

Karmapolis: What was the personal event that happened in your life that focussed your attention on the idea that a parasite like the Archons, the flyers or some kind of extraterrestrial entities, affect our perception of the universe?

JLL: The sense that something distorts our perception has come to me gradually, not triggered by a specific personal event. However, I did have remarkable ("occult") experiences from the age of four, such as lucid dreams in which I encountered magical beings who came to assist or teach me, as well as other beings who attacked me. I have been directly aware of both kinds of intervention since that age.

Karmapolis: Do you think that some extraterrestrial beings like the Annunaki or the Grays are the incarnations of this parasite, or that those alien beings are more shadowed or possessed (than us) by this parasite, this predatory intelligence?

JLL: I follow the Gnostic teachings that the primary predatory intelligence facing humanity is the Archontes. I believe that they are identical with the Annunaki and the modern Grays.

Karmapolis: The Gnostics warned us about this predatory creature: they described the Archons and told us how we can be affected by them. Did the Archons create us? What is the legacy they gave us?

JLL: The Gnostics taught that the Archons did not create us, but they are caught in a delusion, and they think they are our creators. One of their main goals is to convince us that they created us – in effect, to get us to think as they do. As far as I know, there is no “legacy” we have received from the Archon ETs. They are inferior to us in will and intelligence, though superior in navigational technology for travelling among the planets, in telepathy and techniques of imitation (virtual reality). I believe that the Archons are identical with the “Watchers” of Enoch, entities who are credited with teaching metal-working and cosmetic adornment to humanity. If the Gnostics were correct, the Archon ETs attempt to take credit for imparting certain skills like this to humanity, but the claim is false, I believe. We ourselves have discovered these skills, but forgotten how, so we are susceptible to accept the explanation of a foreign or alien intervention.

Karmapolis: Do you believe that the Archons can take an organic form to exist? Do you believe for instance that the Archons and the Greys are the same thing?

JLL: In my understanding, the Archons are an inorganic species. Perhaps silicon and mercury, as Kerner suggests. The Greys are cyborgs, resembling human form – or, to be precise, the form of a premature fetus. Gnostic texts decribe the production of the Archon species as an abortion, hence the form of a premature human body. The Archons are only body, they have no soul. Yes, I am convinced that the Gnostic Archons are identical with modern Greys of the embryonic type. Whitley Streiber observed that the Grey ETs exhibit a high degree of neotony – that is, they have the form of an entity that is not fully formed when it is born.

Karmapolis: In their interpretation of Gnostic texts, scholars outline the crucial role played by an individual they call Jesus Christ. This character warned us about the Archons. Is this the same Jesus known from the New Testament ? Why is the message from Jesus contained in the New Testament and in the Nag Hammadi Codices so different? If it is not the same character, is the “Christ” in Gnostic writings a power that possesses some people (such as “prophets”), and is the power described in the NHC texts completely different from the one described in the New Testament ?

JLL: These are big and troublesome questions. Some of the language in these questions reflects the typical confusion - or disinformation, if you will - about Gnostic materials. In fact, the name Christ never occurs in the Nag Hammadi Codices, nor does the name Jesus. Rather, there is a recurring code: Coptic XC or XRC (translated CHS or CHRS) and IC or HC (translated IS). For instance, in The Tripartite Tractate (117.10) you find HC in Coptic, and the translators modify this to H(COY)C, “Esous,” then translated into the name Jesus. You can see how far scholars must go to manipulate the codes and make them fit a preconception. Most Gnostic texts use the terms “the Savior,” the “Lord” and the “Revealer,” with no specific mention of Jesus or Christ at all.

Scholars who come from a Christian background and consider the NHC to be early Christian writings routinely decode XRC as Christ, or sometimes as Chrest, and IC as Jesus. There is, however, no clear or firm basis for this convention. I am convinced that these codes do not refer either to “the Christ” of Saint Paul or the “historical Jesus” of the New Testament. The codes are used precisely to avoid those identifications. The term “the living Jesus” found in the NHC refers to an inner guide or psychic entity, not a historical person. To Gnostics “the living Jesus” indicated a spiritual force that does not die, hence it could not be a real human person. Jesus Christ in the NT says things that would never have been said by a Gnostic initiate. His words and acts are inconsistent with an illumined teacher from the Mysteries. The Gnostic Christos is not the Christ, the Only-Begotten Son of God, in the theology of John and Paul. The Gnostic Christos is an Aeon, a divine force that does not assume human form. Gnostics denied the Incarnation. In their view, no human person has the privilege to incarnate an Aeon, a Divinity.

Karmapolis: Do you see a tendency (even very small) in the Roman Catholic church to recognize the legitimacy of the Nag Hammadi texts, including the existence of the Archons, or in fact to deny the content and the pertinence, the relevance of the Nag Hammadi materials?

JLL: I see no tendency to recognize the genuine non-Christian character of the NHC, and certainly no tendency to recognize the Archons. Bear in mind that Gnostic teachings attribute Roman Catholic religion (the salvationist belief system) to the deviant mental influence of the Archons. If Catholic authorities were to recognize the Gnostic message, they would be admitting that their belief system is an extraterrestrial implant in the human mind!

Karmapolis: People often compare the importance of the discovery of the Nag Hammadi texts with the Dead Sea Scrolls. As far as you know, can we find in the Dead Sea Scrolls the same warning about the Archons, about the fact that the creation of the universe is a mistake contained in the NHC ? Who wrote the Dead Sea Scrolls and who wrote the NHC? Were they enemies?

JLL: Great question. This connection, between the DSS and the NHC, is crucial. To my knowledge no scholar has indicated the cross-references between these ancient texts, but they do exist. Let me elaborate.

The DSS do not warn us about the Archons because they were written by an extremist sect who were manipulated by the Archons. The Zaddikim (“Righteous Ones”) of the Dead Sea was a violent, apocalyptic sect dedicated to celestial beings, called the Kenoshim, who appeared to them in shining chariots. Some DSS texts (notably, 4Q405, in the Sabbath Songs) describe the appearance and movement of flying saucer type UFOs exactly as they are described in modern sightings. In short, I am convinced that the sect at Qumran was an apocalyptic cult of UFO contactees, like the suicide cult, Heaven´s Gate. South of Qumran was a Gnostic encampment of a group called the Archontics – who took this name, I believe, because it was their mission to spy upon the Archons who were controlling the Zaddikim. In one Gnostic text, the Apocalypse of James (25.15), the Revealer says, “Jerusalem is the dwelling place of many Archons.” I am certain that many Gnostics from the Mystery temples in the Near East were aware of the intrusion of the Archons. They detected the aliens and their effect, a mental or psychic infection that took the form of religious madness. Jerusalem was highly infected, and so was Qumran.

The NHC does not say that “the universe is a mistake.” It says that the world system we inhabit, our planetary system, is an anomaly due to the presence of the Archons who impinge upon life on earth. Gnostic cosmology explains the emergence of the Archons at the cosmic level, so Gnostics understood the origin and behavior of these alien entities. The Dead Sea sectarians were completely duped by the Archons whom they saw as celestial Angels. They believed that the Archon leader, Jehovah, was their creator God. Gnostics viewed these beliefs as religious madness due to the ideological virus spread by the Archons. Several passages in the DSS scrolls refer directly to Gnostics who are considered to be arch-enemies of the Zaddikim. To my knowledge, no scholar has pointed out that the Dead Sea cult targeted the Gnostics in this manner. The Zaddikim wanted to completely destroy the Gnostics. If my theory is correct, we can understand why.

One more point: the Nag Hammadi Codices were discovered in December 1945, but their importance was not recognized until the summer of 1947, exactly when the Dead Sea Scrolls were found. Readers will of course realize that the summer of 1947 was the time of Kenneth Arnold´s UFO sighting of flying saucers, and the Roswell incident. It is amazing that ancient materials written by an ET/UFO cult, as well as other materials, exposing the nature of that cult, surfaced at the exact moment of the 1947 wave and the Roswell incident. This is truly “cosmic coincidence.”

Karmapolis: Why was the Roman Catholic Church so stubborn, and so reluctant to give access to the Dead Sea Scrolls? Was it the same reaction for the Nag Hammadi materials?

JLL: The Vatican controlled the international team of scholars associated with the Ecole Biblique in Jerusalem. These scholars, such as de Vaux and Milik, withheld the DSS materials because they show the true origins of Christianity in a very negative light. The DSS texts reveal that the ideology of salvation in Christianity did not originate with Jesus, but came through the Zaddikim cult. This is a nasty blow to Christian belief in the uniqueness of their religion.

With the Nag Hammadi materials, a different team of scholars was engaged. They did not delay or dissimulate. However, it must be noted that the usual interpretation of the NHC is very favorable to Christianity, or made to look that way. Consequently, the NHC are less threatening to Christian faith than the DSS. However, in my radical interpretation of the Gnostic teachings, the message of the NHC is clearly anti-Christian: that is, against the ideology of divine redemption, not against love, kindness, and good works, of course. (But then, love, kindness, and good works are not the monopoly of Christians, are they?)

Karmapolis: Anthropologists like Michael Harner or Carlos Castaneda gave the same kind of description of a mysterious creature: Harner saw in a vision the Maninkaris, a black creature, a mix between a whale and a reptile (pterodactile). These creatures need to hide themselves and are considered by the Indians of Amazonia to be the source of all life on earth. Castaneda describes the flyers as horrible black and huge fishy creatures that eat the consciousness of mankind. Can we compare those creatures? Do you think that they have the same nature?

JLL: No, I don´t find this comparison to be valid. The vision of the Amazonian Indians is probably an ancestral memory of the origins of human life. Gnostic teachings on this matter are similar to those of indigenous peoples who claim that the “first people” came from the skies. This is called panspermia in modern science: the seeding of the human species on Earth from an extraterrestrial source. In the imagination of native peoples like those who initiated Harner, the seeds of life arrive in huge canoes, worms, dragons, and other such forms. This is a way to visualize panspermia. DNA itself can be visualized as a coiling serpent.

Castaneda’s description of the flyers refers to a totally different phenomenon, a type of predatory being that is bat-like or dragon-like. Throughout history the dragon has been viewed as a benign angelic figure, even a type of superior consciousness, but the “reptilian” type of the Archon described by Gnostics is different. We must exert some imagination and distinguish the universal dragon “archetype” from the specific form of the predatory alien, the reptilian Archon, called “drakonic” in the NHC.

Karmapolis: Why do you compare the Gnostic knowledge to shamanism? Did the Gnostics engage in research about cognition, and other ways to perceive reality? Did they use hallucinogenic substances like shamans use ayahuasca, peyote or psilocybin ?

JLL: Don Juan says that sorcery (shamanism) is about shifting the parameters of perception. I believe that Gnostics were masters of this practice. They were heirs to a long tradition of shamanism deriving from the indigenous peoples of Europe and Asia going back to Paleolithic times. In Gnosis, the path of heightened perception (to use Castaneda´s term), we see a sophisticated method of shamanism, a kind of high-tech shamanism, if you will. Techniques of paranormal perception were taught and transmitted in the Mystery Schools founded and led by gnostokoi, “those who know about divine or supernatural matters.”

According to the “Wasson thesis,” the ritual use of psychoactive plants was the basis of all genuine religion on Earth. Gordon Wasson and Albert Hofmann, the Swiss chemist who discovered LSD, proposed that the kykeon, the sacred potion drunk at the Eleusinian Mysteries, was a mixture of ergot fungus, the organic basis of LSD. Hence, it was a psychedelic potion. Much solid research has been done that supports this idea. Also, the use of psychoactive mushrooms in the Mysteries has also been proposed, based on good research. It is now certain that ancient shamanic cults such as the Mysteries used psychoactive plants to achieve temporary egodeath and shift the parameters of perception. I believe that the Gnostics were deeply skilled in the use of psychoactive plants, including mushrooms. However, I have not found any direct evidence of this in the NHC materials.

Karmapolis: Some religions and philosophies state that our material universe is an illusion and a trap and that our consiousness is tangled in an entropic web of deception. If we believe Castaneda, the human being is directed by a consciousness that is not its own counscious mind, but the mind of the predator. This view can sound very dark and pessimistic. What is the way out of this trap, this mess?

JLL: There is really no trap, but there is a confrontation with the Trickster, the alien presence in our own minds. Gnostics did not teach that the world, this physical planet and the realm of the senses, is an illusion or a deception. They taught that it is a deep and beautiful mystery, but we are blocked from entering the mystery in depth and in a lucid way by factors in our own minds. The Archons can insinuate their alien intelligence into our minds, but they cannot control or take over our minds by sheer force. However, if we let ourselves fall under their spell, they can entirely rule our minds. This occurs through our abdication of our own consciousness, not through their domination, however.

The way out of the trap is to discern what is genuinely human in our minds, and what is inhumane, stupid, mechanical, blind, imitative – in short, we must understand human potential in order to see how it is distorted and subverted. Imagine, for instance, that you never heard Beethoven´s 5th symphony played as it really is, but only a distorted version with the notes totally deformed. You could only know that the music was distorted if you knew the true, undistorted version. Likewise, we must realize our authentic minds, our true human potential, in order to see how we are deviated. This is the challenge of the predators.

I have a little phrase for this situation: I say, Human potential comes in a trickster package.

Karmapolis: The “laws” of nature are based on predation and fear. It is in fact the same thing for mankind, even if it is more subtle. Everything is based on duality and struggle. Is it possible that it is due to the influence or the manipulation of the universe by the Archons or the flyers? Without those creatures, is it possible to think that the world could be different, not dualistic and predatory, or do you think that dualism is in the very essence of the universe with or without the Archons?

JLL: This world, meaning life here on the Earth, is actually not as you describe it. The description you propose is already a result of deviant perception. There is as much evidence in nature for symbiosis and cooperation as there is for predation and fear – far more, in fact. The way the Earth works is a symbiotic miracle, and it is a magical event as well, and so there is no question that it is due to “the influence or the manipulation of the universe by the Archons or the flyers.” The Archons influence the way you perceive the world, not the world itself. The primary power in the world we inhabit is the indwelling divinity of the planet, the Gaian intelligence, called Sophia by the Gnostics. If you are aligned to the Gaian intelligence, you do not see the world as a place of fear and predation, but of beauty, bounty, and magic.

Karmapolis: In the Gnostic tradition, “Sophia” is the divine entity who made a mistake and created the universe and the Archons. How can we find and claim the connection with this originator principle and avoid the contact with the Archons?

JLL: One way to reach Sophia is to surrender to the beauty and majesty of nature, to enter the mystical presence of the Earth. In nature the mystical and physical aspects of reality are merged. Beauty is supernatural. The purpose of Gnostic practices and related shamanic methods was to depart (Fr. sortir, hence sorcery) from the human social realm, shed the filters of conditioning, and commune directly with the planetary intelligence, Gaia-Sophia. I believe this was done through temporary dissolution of the ego with the aid and guidance of sacred allies, such as plant-teachers. There is no way to avoid the Archons, but we can build an immunity to them by strengthening our vital bond with Gaia-Sophia, the living planet. The Archons are aliens who alienate us from Gaia.

Precise language is important in the expression of living cosmology. Precise poetic terms, if you will. The Aeon Sophia did not make a mistake and create the universe and the Archons. She acted unilaterally, without pairing with another Aeon, and projected herself beyond the galactic core. Aeons are formless powers in the galactic core of each galaxy. There are many galaxies in the Universe. Sophia did not create the Universe, she emanated the world order we experience as the triple system: sun-moon-earth. Sophia did not make a mistake, but she exaggerated her involvement in her emanation, her Dreaming. Hence, she herself became embodied in her Dreaming. This is a rare event, not typical of the way Aeons operate. As a side effect of her excessive involvement in her Dreaming, Sophia plunged from the galactic core. (Imagine a surge or spike of luminous, foam-like matter from the galactic core into the encircling arms.) The impact she made on the elementary matter in the galactic arms produced an inorganic species, the Archons. The Archons then proceeded to fabricate an inorganic planetary system, a clockwork mechanism. The Earth, the living planet that embodies Sophia, was then captured in that lifeless system. This is the “mistake” – or, better said, the anomaly of our world system.

Karmapolis: In the Gnostic tradition, as I understand it, Sophia (wisdom) is not the only “Godhead” or source of eternity and perfection. Can we compare Sophia to a very sophisticated and elaborate advanced being, some kind of super extraterrestrial intelligence? Or must we admit that the source of everything is not an unique entity but more a polytheistic concept ?

JLL: In Gnostic cosmology, Sophia is an Aeon, a divinity at the cosmic level, but she is not alone. She is part of a company of Aeons, the gods of the Pleroma or Fullness. There are many Pleromas, many galaxies, in the Universe. The Gnostic myth of the Fallen Goddess is about our galaxy and our planet, not the entire Universe. If we do not know what´s happening here, locally, how can we know what´s happening anywhere else in the universe? The test is, to get our story straight, and then go into the larger story.

Due to the peculiar intensity of her Dreaming, Sophia came to be embodied in the planet earth and so She is, for us who inhabit the Earth, the very godhead in which we live. She is the true, living Matrix. Sophia is the Godhead of Nature, theologically speaking. What is She like? This is something we must come to understand by practices, through a path of sacred learning, Gnosis. All the Mysteries were dedicated to knowing Gaia and serving the higher intelligence of the Aeon Sophia. The “source of everything” is a Mystery. Why speculate on what we cannot know when we face the adventure of exploring what we can know?

Karmapolis: Despite the bad rumors and perception around conspiracy theories, what do you think about the other conception of parasitism represented by Branton, David Icke, and the zulu shaman Credo Mutwa, who deeply believe that the parasite is in fact a reptilian entity and that this entity shadows or invades the bodies of the rulers of this world, people like George Bush ?

JLL: I think that we need to train our imaginations to detect the presence of alien entities, and distinguish what is real from what is fantasy. The alchemists had a rule: Proceed according to nature, observing the workings of nature, and perform the Great Work with the true powers of imagination, not with fantasy thinking. This is a matter of discipline we face on the path of heightened perception. I believe that some indigenous sources such as Credo Mutwa have valid things to say about the Archons. At the same time, I suspect that the reptilian scenario is blown out of proportion due to fantasy thinking and mental manipulation. As far as I know, the alien predators called Archons by the Gnostics can take two forms, embryonic (the Grey ETs) and drakonic, a reptilian type, but they cannot and do not possess the bodies of human beings.

There is an element of common sense that must be maintained in considering paranormal and supernatural phenomena. George Bush does not have to be a reptilian to be a monster. We need to recognize that human beings can act in monstrous ways because they are deviated by the reptilian predators, without adopting the fantasy that they are actually turned into reptilians. To me the scenario proposed by Icke and others gives too much power to the predators. How then, can Icke and his witnesses offer first-hand evidence of reptilian shapeshifting? Well, perception is a construct. All perception. Bear in mind that the Archons are masters of virtual reality. In Coptic (the language of the NHC) this is called HAL, “simulation”. Gnostic texts say that the Archons “abduct souls by night.” This is done through virtual reality, VR simulation techniques. Of course, the “VR” of the Archons is as real for them as our earth reality is for us. The difference is, we cannot interact symbiotically with VR. The other difference is, the Archons manipulate inorganic quantum fields, but we manipulate the perceptual bands that shape those fields. Gnostics taught that we are superior to the Archons in thought, perception, and intention.

I would say that these reports are existentially true: the witnesses have perceived shapeshifting, but the perception is an effect of the reptilian powers of VR rather than a genuine phenomenon, an event in nature. Serpents are born from eggs, and they shed skins. This is what nature shows us, and it can tell us something about how reptilians behave if we approach this matter with genuine imagination and not fantasy.

Karmapolis: Some authors (like Paul Von Ward) denounce YHVH or Yahveh as an advanced being, an extraterrestrial entity who wants to rule our world with not really pure and nice intentions. Do you believe that YHVH is an Archon or the representative of the Archons?

JLL: Gnostic texts clearly state that Jehovah is the “Lord Archon,” a reptilian type of alien predator who dominates the hive-mentality of the embryonic or Grey aliens. Jehovah, whom the Gnostics called Yaldabaoth, is truly an extraterrestrial being whose realm is the planetary system independent of the earth, sun and moon. He is not an “advanced being” (i.e., more evolved than humans) but a demented alien with certain superhuman or deific powers. Gnostics taught that Jehovah infects humanity with the belief that he is their creator god, but in fact he cannot create anything. The NHC is very clear that Jehovah-Yaldabaoth is the commander of the Archon species.

Karmapolis: The Gnostics denounce the role of the Archons. Did you find the same kind of warning in other religious traditions ?

JLL: No, I can´t say that I have found this information so clearly and thoroughly stated in other religious traditions. Bear in mind that Gnosis was a path of knowledge, not a religion. The Mysteries were schools of paranormal knowledge, not religious institutions. I am convinced that all religion is a deviant from human potential, but the three Abrahamic religions, Judaism, Christianity and Islam, are potentially lethal. They lead to terminal deviation of our species. You will not find any religion that warns you that it is dangerous to your mental health and your physical survival. Gnostics saw in salvationist religion both the evidence and instrument of alien intrusion.

Karmapolis: The Gnostic teachings and the Mysteries Schools are the same thing, in our view. Conspiracy theorists like Springmeier and Icke believe that satanic rituals came from mystery schools and think that Mystery Schools are the roots of Satanic and ritual abuses, the Illuminati and the Masonic tradition. How and why do those authors make the relation between mysteries schools, Illuminism and Satanism? Why do they denounce with so much violence both the the Gnostic and Mysteries Schools and Roman Catholic religion, when we know that the Gnostics were persecuted by the Roman Catholics?

JLL: Icke and other conspiracy theorists who propose alien intervention are unfamiliar with the Mysteries, I suspect, for two reasons: first, they do not have direct experience of egodeath and instruction by the Light comparable to the experience in the Mysteries, and second, they cannot distinguish the methods and motives of the Illuminati from the genuine Gnostics. The Illuminati were deranged initiates, who had deep knowledge of Mystery practices but misused it to acquire social and political power. The Mystery Schools were not training camps for Illuminati, as Icke believes. This is a grave error on his part. Due to lack of direct experience, Icke and the others are unable to realize that adepts of the Serpent Power (Kundalini) were directly opposed to the Illuminati who made a pact with the reptilian powers. As I have explained in my articles, we are given Kundalini as the force to repel alien intrusion. The benign, healing Serpent is not a reptilian entity but an innate component of our divine biological inheritence. Speculation and research (even research as good as Icke´s) cannot teach us to make such distinctions. Only direct experience can.

Illuminati were strictly forbidden to participate in the Mysteries, once they had been detected. In other words, the Illuminati were practitioners of occult sciences (mainly, imprinting and mind control) who had to be expelled from the Mysteries… but this is a story (an extremely important story, I might add) of which Icke and the others seem to be totally ignorant.

Karmapolis: What are the conceptions of heaven and hell in Gnostic terms?

JLL: There is no conception of heaven and hell in Gnostic teachings.

Karmapolis: Clive Prince and Lynn Pycknett in a book called The Stargate Conspiracy denounce the fact that with the New Age, global manipulation will create a syncretism (a mix of Buddhism, Hinduism, and the three religions of the Book), a new one world religion based on old Egyptian cult and the worship of the “Council of the 9.” In this new religion, we find the book the "Keys of Enoch” and people like James Hurtak and Andrea Puharich, the order of Melchisedech (that we find also in the Mormon cult). What do you think about this? Is it another manipulation from the Archons?

JLL: I think all this is a fantasy shared by people desperate for power and spiritual status, and some elements of these scenarios may be affected by Archontic deviation. The challenge in facing the alien Tricksters is to discern what is really deviant and dangerous, by contrast to mere folly and foolishness. There is a lot of foolishness in new world order conspiracy theories. There is a lot of spiritual phoniness and pretence among people who channel “the council of the Nine.” This has been going on for many years now… The problem here is, the fantasy material is like quicksand: you just sink into it and you cannot crawl out. With the clear and precise indications given by Gnostics about the Archons, we can begin to see what is happening in our minds and correct the madness – although we must do this one by one, individually, for we cannot correct the madness in the minds of others.

June 2005 Brussels